"Scientists, these archaeologists, those people there, think we've already gone through one ice age. Others say we've gone through… I believe we've been through four or more, given the time the world has," Tim said. .

Of a long interview, only a very small excerpt had been published. During the conversation in 1995, the singer spared no one. Everything that did not enter was published 14 years later in Revista Brasileiros. Today, page B! rescues a historic interview with Tim Maia.

*By Marcio Gaspar

It was the beginning of Fernando Henrique Cardoso's first term as president. The Real Plan was completing one year, with the government and population celebrating the fall in inflation − from 40% to the then almost unbelievable 2% per month; the real at parity with the dollar and the consequent spree of the middle class abroad. It was 1995 and Brazilian music mourned the recent loss of Tom Jobim (in December 1994), while Mamonas Assassinas dominated radio and TV. In an aparthotel in Jardins, in São Paulo, Tim Maia received journalists Marcio Gaspar and Lauro Lisboa Garcia for an interview whose motto was the release of the album new ice age. Lauro, reporter for “Caderno 2″ from The State of S. Paul, who would publish some excerpts of the conversation a few days later; and Marcio, from Qualis, an ephemeral music magazine, which would close its doors before the interview was published.

Most of the memorable conversation with Tim Maia, who would die three years later (on March 15, 1998, at age 56), remained unpublished until now. You can hear excerpts from the interview on the blog. www.afroencias.com.br. Journalists found a surprisingly good-natured Tim Maia at 9 am that morning. And as was his way, the singer did not mince words. In addition to his immense musical talent, Tim Maia's authenticity was another of his best qualities.

Marcio Gaspar – What's this about waking up so early? New phase, much healthier?
Tim Maia -
 No, I always woke up early. But now, I'm waking up really early because… I think this is old age stuff, you know? What a rooster. Old rooster roosts early, eh? And he wakes up earlier. I think that's it, must be the age. I always woke up early... sometimes I didn't even sleep (laughs).
MG - Do you often listen to your old records?
TM - 
I'm listening now… It's the biggest thing, you know? As I'm a guy who always records songs talking about something that happened, then you can remember. Remember the "cumadinhas", the nice moments and the sad moments too.

MG - Among these albums, which one do you think is the coolest?
TM -
 Sung in English (Tim Maia, 1978) is what I like best.

Lauro Lisboa Garcia – On this new album, you recorded “Corcovado” and “Meditação” in English, and had already recorded both in Portuguese. Why record in English?
TM - 
It was a tribute to Antonio Carlos Jobim. This version that is coming out is five years old. The voice in Portuguese, I recorded over the voice I had put in English. That's it, in the Tim Maia Bossa Nova. I have it on CD too, but I released it for Vitória Régia (Tim's own seal). It was the only record I didn't give to Continental. That's my retirement, you know?

LLG - Did this record sell well?
TM - 
sold. I always say that it sold less, that even the record companies say not to pay royalties. I also say it sold less. And there's no way to prove it, right? Neither do they.

MG - How many records do you think you've sold so far?
TM -
 I think much less than Chitãozinho and Xororó, see? Robert (Carlos) also sells more. But, more or less like Jorge Ben, Fábio Jr., we sell like this, the same, on the same basis. One hundred thousand discs, each disc. Fortunately.

MG - That BMG phase sold like hell, right?
TM - 
Not. It sold more or less because BMG is like that product, Denorex (dandruff shampoo): “It is, but it is not”. BMG makes more records for other people. That record factory that manufactures for others is no longer that idealism thing… I mean, none of them have artistic idealism anymore.

LLG - Tim, how are your rights in relation to the records you produced for Seroma (the singer's editor)?
TM - 
Look, these albums that are being released by Continental/Warner are albums that I authorized and I'm earning a minimal percentage, that little bit that we always get. Polygram released without authorization. I have two lawsuits against Polygram. One for the first record, that one The Art I don't know what (The Art of Tim Maia, 1988). And now, eleven CDs… They've released a CD of mine now… My no, wow, it's Cassiano, Hyldon and me. They are the “cricket kings”. This record should be called “Os reis do crilo”, because I am the king of the cricket, Cassiano is the god of the cricket and Hyldon is the cricket (guffaws). And now, they've launched another cricket too, they've added another one: Luiz Melodia. By the way, this CD - it was a record and became a CD -, Tim Maia, Hyldon and Cassiano, has a nature photograph on the cover. Interesting… I think they thought we were too ugly, they thought we looked like a robber. I know, fuck… they didn't even put our faces, I thought it was so… Polygram… they do that. Sony Music too. Sony now took some royalties that it had to pay Seroma and paid directly to the composers, Michel and Gilson (Mendonça, authors of “Discoverer of the Seven Seas”). Wow, there was a lot of confusion, I had to call them too, I fought with the composers. Soon after, Lulu Santos records the same song, it explodes. Washington Olivetto put it on a Rider deal there, played it. It's very relative, you know?

LLG - But, you didn't think Lulu Santos was bad for re-recording “Discoverer of the Seven Seas”, right? You had already recorded a song of his (“Like a Wave”)…
TM - 
No, no. I mean, this W/Brasil thing was this: I would record a song by Lulu Santos, then he would record a song by me. But Washington chose that song and didn't try to find out if the song was mine or not. The music is by Gilson and Michel. Then, there was a confusion and I was already in friction with them, right? Due to a recording of Deborah Blond, Bland, Blondor…

MG - Deborah Blando.
TM -
 Deborah Blando. She recorded this song on a Coca-Cola promotional disc, which sold 13 copies and created R$15, R$15 in rights there. They would have to pay me the R$25 for me to take my XNUMX% off the publisher and pay the songwriters. Then they paid straight away. The same thing happened with Som Livre, in the song “Paixão Antiga”, by Marcos Valle and Paulo Sérgio Valle. So, there's this thing about the record companies' disrespect for songwriters and artists. That's why I'm calling Bonifácio Sobrinho (Boni, then programming director of Rede Globo). And in all the actions that we are taking against Bonifácio Sobrinho, Mr. Roberto Marinho is being listed.

MG - Are you banned from Globo?
TM - 
I think they tried to ban me for a while, but now it won't happen anymore because I've come to the conclusion that I have to fight for my rights. I want this to be an example for other artists. I'm filing a criminal action and a civil action against Bonifácio Sobrinho. However, I communicated with him earlier, saying that we would file the lawsuit, as is done. It is customary for you to arrive and diplomatically warn the guy: “Either give or go down!”, understand? I sent him a letter; he did not say anything. The same letter we addressed to Roberto Marinho; he didn't say anything either. Then, we sent another letter… All these letters, we registered in a notary's office, for real in the court order as well. They didn't give a damn. So, now we are filing a civil and a criminal action. Because I think what he's doing is a crime, you know? He's boycotting me. And is it a boycott like that for life, sacumé? It's not a boycott like, "You won't sing here for three months because you screwed us." They claim that I wasn't on Fausto Silva's show and that takes away his morale… It doesn't, he's a dictator. Boni is a dictator. He can fire me because I'm calling him a dictator, but that's okay. Mariozinho Rocha (at the time, musical director of Rede Globo) has already called me twice. He sued me criminally because I said that he received R$ 10 thousand for each song that is put on the soap opera. There, a guy from Newspapers in Brazil – I always forget his name, the son of a bitch… – he asked me: “Is it true that Mariozinho gets ten?”; I said, “No, he gets fifteen!” (laugh). I mean, I'm going to call them to put an end to this farce, this lie, that the whole world knows that everyone receives jabaculê in Brazil, right?

MG - But nobody speaks.
TM - 
It's that thing about my music ("new ice age"), huh? "Everybody knows, but nobody wants to say." So, for example, Lauro was saying: “Gee, you released this record (back to lighten, 1994) half in the unknown, half in the bush”.

LLG - No, it's just that the album came out and didn't have a big impact.
TM - 
It didn't have any repercussions because… do you see the thing? That music (“Back to Clear”) is having the biggest impact on the shows. The nickname of this song is “melô do ultima saber”. I think everyone can relate to this cuckold thing; the Brazilian is the king of the horn. Women, mainly, identify themselves, because they are gored too, right? This song didn't play because I didn't pay anyone jabá. Even the previous song, “Como uma Onda”, played like hell. Then I also found out how much jabaculê costs, right? The jabás are strong, man…

LLG - from radio?
TM -
 Radio… radio stations that didn't even have that live exclusively on jabaculê. Because it's not the radio that lives. Those who live on this are the programmers and the announcers of each schedule. I don't think the owner of the radio makes a dime from it... but it's too much, man. There's a radio that asks R$40 for a song.

LLG - To play for how long?
TM - 
One month. Thirty days, forty thousand reais. But then, the music bursts, right? Because he performs ten times a day, that fucking “neh, nhem, nhem” in the guy's ear… On television, the exact same thing. It's jabá for everyone… Silvio Santos has less. I think his programs are very bad, so it's not possible for him, you know (guffaws)? Silvio Santos is too bad. THE Silvio Santos show, my friend… Another thing I would like to say, I want to send a message to Caçulinha. Caçulinha had a wonderful set on Canal 7; damn, I followed all those artists: Elis Regina, Jair Rodrigues, all those people. Wow, a very nice guy… Caçulinha is very popular in the artistic world. I don't know why he put up with it, man! Now, they put him with a horn thing, you see? There's a horn on his head, man! Haven't you seen it? Once, they put it in the fridge, I don't know if you saw it, they put it in the fridge! Yeah, a penguin in the fridge, with that little piano. And Faustão remains, the entire program messing with the “thing”… And he doesn't even play anything on that program! There is a time when he says: “Toca, Caçulinha”! (imitating Fausto Silva): “Oh Caçulinha’s nose! Caçulinha is an asshole!”. Caçulinha is the spitting bag, the punching bag… Wow, why? I would even like to invite Caçulinha to play with us in the band Vitória Régia; we'll get him an accordion, he can even come with his little piano, poor thing... He doesn't need that, he's a renowned guy! Before Fausto Silva arrived, Caçulinha had been there for years… I find that so ridiculous… They should put Bonifácio Sobrinho there with his horn and Roberto Marinho in the fridge. This they don't do. Faustinho stays there pulling Roberto Marinho's ass. “Hi, Mr. Robertinho. How are you? Everything ok? How are you, Roberto?” This is something that denigrates the image of a musician, you know? The musician gets screwed up, the musician is a bag of jokes. Musicians are meant to play music! Not to stay there, being a laughing stock.

MG - You always fought for the recognition of the musician, always demanded the band Vitória Régia in all your shows, contracts, credits, etc. But, at the same time, if the guy makes a mistake at a show, you're like: “Fuck, I don't know what…”. Dirty clothes shouldn't be washed at home?
TM - 
It's totally spontaneous. There's nothing wrong with it, no. It's a touch when it hurts me. It hurts me. There's no such thing as scolding the musician, this is more folklore. The thing is more with sound technician; the musician does not. Now, when you have a little limp… Man, that's totally spontaneous.

MG - You play everything too, right?
TM - 
I play some instruments. Today we have a problem here to program a battery, which is a lot of shit. We have to program a drum set because the drummer "left the band"... All those scoldings I gave as a musician don't even reach the thousandth part that each one did to me. Eight musicians triggered me! Only one took me R$117, all at once! One hundred and twelve thousand reais because I lost the case, plus five from FGH… FG… FGTS. Another, who is a trumpeter, is a fire sergeant until today, called me too and already took R$ 100 thousand. I tried to fight and everything… And he had a drunk that just arrived. He came in last year, totally drunk, lying in the ditch... and I still spent R$ 5 thousand with the guy's lawyer. You must see the lawyers! They think more than the guys themselves! Then, the lawyer arrives: “It's going to give cinquinho”. Cinquinho, son?! “You know how it is.” I was triggered by eight musicians! I spoke to the mother of one of them on the phone: “Hi, how are you?”; (making a woman's voice) “Hi Tim Maia! Take care of my son.” “No, my lady. If you had known… I would have already killed you and delivered you in a little coffin: your son is there, I took care of him.” There was another one, a trombonist, who I took his son home with. I was triggered…

MG - But there are also those who have been with you for a long time, right?
TM - 
Now there is no more. It only has the Chumbinho (Paulo Roberto, bassist), because Tinho (João Batista Martins, saxophonist), which had been there for ten years, came out last week. Because she had Tim's show and Tinho's show. That's a problem, you know? Musician… rare is the musician friend, understand? For example, I'm going to record with Os Cariocas now, next week. The Cariocas… thirty years singing together. They sing because they like to sing, you know? They rehearse all day. Thirty years together and that thing over there, all for music. It's not a lie, it's all about music, serious stuff, man! That's a musician, understand? And there are people who have been playing for I don't know how many years… for example, the case of Caçulinha. He's a great musician, but he hasn't evolved because he's only just started buying keyboards. But also, how do you do it? If you subject yourself to a business like that...

LLG - And the television audience ends up not even knowing the value it has. 
TM - 
Yeah, he plays well, he's a fucking musical guy. So… the musician business is relative as hell, you know? There's a friend of mine who says that musicians, lawyers and bricklayers are awesome (laugh). And it's true, man! And the only one who works with them – but who slows down a bit – is the bricklayer. Because this one still does, at least the guy does. It pisses you off, but he's a humble person, who wants to give you an extra knife because you have more than him, right? But, lawyer and musician, my son... The other day, in an article, the guy asked: “What about the lawyer business, how do you do it?”. “Oh, I'm three now. I send one, another to watch over that one and that one to watch what I sent later.” Gee, the guys were pissed at me back in Rio! The Bar Association said: “Hey, Tim Maia, what is this business, boy? You make a statement like that, it's a joke." I'll send three soon. And even then, it's still pretty difficult.

MG - Are you going to make your songbook or do you still think this is foot in the grave?
TM - 
It's half, right? songbook it's not so much, but biography… It's like that Globo special I used to have. When the guy was already well shot, Globo made a special with the guy. Then, next week the guy, boom!. Then release the special, right? The guy died a week before, must be fresh...

MG - How did you get into that story of the Cultura Racional sect, from the book Universe in Disenchantment?
TM -
 Mystical phase, right (laughs)? I took fifty mescalines and wanted to be a member of Saint Francis of Assisi (guffaws), peace and love, that hippie thing: everyone walked to Bahia, that “peace and love, lots of LSD” thing… I went in there to have some mescalines. Paper fifty. Then, I traveled like hell and in the middle of the trip I said: “Oh, I'm going to turn to Jesus, Hail Mary” (guffaws)… Then I got into it. The Rational Culture said that it was a preparation for us to get in touch with extraterrestrial beings. Me, as I like the ufology business… I've been into these since I was a kid and I went into that one there to see if that was it, but it wasn't. It was a spiritism thing, you know? There were other artists: Jackson do Pandeiro, even Procópio Ferreira, poor thing, before he died, he joined the wave of the Universe in Disenchantment. That's crazy… Lúcio Mauro, a bit of an artist, you know? Altamiro Carrilho… Everybody on the move.

MG - Don't you think you should attract those who want to set you up because of the reputation of being crazy?
TM - 
Of course, precisely. They think we're sleeping, but we're always awake. There are several entrepreneurs who have already set up to make money with me. There was a manager once, in Campinas, who, when it was time to go on stage, he said: “Tim Maia, here’s the thing” – at that time the show was two hundred, I don’t know what it was, but it was two hundred – “you I give a little kiss now and you go back to the hotel…”. Me: “Are you crazy, man? It's four in the morning!" That day, 32 women went to the hospital and we were taken out of the gym in the mobile tactical device. Very polite people who arrive like this: “Son of a bitch!”. That's the least they say, right? It was all black still. “Go, nigga motherfucker!” And all this with a baton that gives shock. They put the baton against the person and “tchen!”. But we were removed from this club by a mobile tactician, at five o'clock in the morning, because there was a general beating at the club, because the guy set up two hundred and in the end he wanted cenzinho, half the fee. There are some show guys there who are my friends to this day, but they made a damn rumor… My mother was still alive, it was a big problem, my mother got sick. They said I had brain cancer. People called my house, crazy, until the day they killed me: “Tim Maia died”. They told my sister: “Did you know that your brother died?”. (Ela): “My brother is sleeping here, crazy!”. There's this folklore that sucks. It's like that business of scolding musicians. What the musicians got out of trouble nobody talks about. They already took me almost R$ 400 thousand, man. Stretch for you to buy three apartments. My car is a Monza, man. I could have a Mitsubishi 446, a BMW, blah blah blah, and I'm paying a musician, R$ 100 thousand each. This one of the R$ 117 thousand was awesome. Do you know what it's like for a guy to take you R$117? Money I've saved my whole life! I was triggered by eight musicians. I tried everything. Do you know what they told me? “Tim Maia, you missed the deadline.” Deadline?! I had a chance to have two trials in one afternoon. I had to get two lawyers...

LLG - Six, anyway, right?
TM - 
Six! Just with this process from the musicians, I've already got involved with about 12 lawyers. We're trying to push with our belly, right? But there is no way.

LLG - You have composed more. I wanted you to talk a little about these last songs and especially about this “New Ice Age”.
TM - 
“New Ice Age” is a song that talks about a possible or probable ice age. I believe it will cool down because we see the news there and notice that the business is changing. I think we are entering a new ice age. There is even a controversy among scientists there: some say that the Earth is warming up. But I think it's getting cold. This warm-up is just a warm-up for the cold to come. And it looks like things are going to cool down. I don't know how long from now, got it? It's in that millennium now. I'm not predicting anything, but "suddenly" in this millennium I'm sure there will be a new ice age. But there's fucking time.

LLG - Where did you get this from?
TM - 
Scientists, these archaeologists, these people there, think that we have already passed through an ice age. Others say we've been through… I believe we've been through about four or more, given how much time the world has. Humans are 60 years old. Earth has four billion. So I believe we've been through several ice ages, flood, Noah's Ark. Noah's Ark was a great flood, right? And it seems to me that the same thing is happening. This greenhouse effect, this ozone layer thing, you know what it's like? This is heating up and then cooling down. I believe this is it. It's an intuitive thing, right? But also many people defend this thesis; it's not just me. There are thousands of scientists who believe that the world is entering a new ice age.

LLG - Are you interested in science?
TM -
 My interest is totally ufological, transcendental. I'm not interested in anything here. I think it's very confusing here... I was talking here yesterday with other reporters from another magazine there, that there are intraterrestrial beings, man. This is proven, everyone knows this. There are beings that inhabit the center of the Earth. There are people who believe in astrology, these things that have nothing to do with it. Astrology has nothing to do with anything! Fuck astrology is an Arab thing, they looked at the stars and concluded I don't know what there, I don't know what there, based on what, man? That the Earth would be the center of the Universe. Then, they saw that it's nothing like that, it's just a Roberto Marinho, a Paulo Maluf, a Roberto Carlos, a Tim Maia, a Maguila, it's a nest where these things, these people live. Wow, Erasmo Carlos, things like that. It's a little nest, a little thing, a little ball where those fools live there. And the part is big. I told reporters here yesterday about this: we are visited by ninety different beings, from different galaxies, different dimensions and there are other things! There are beings from the future, but that's another thing. What I'm talking about is current stuff, extraterrestrial beings from other galaxies. And beings that come from our own Earth, that inhabit the center of the Earth. They are called Lunars. They are white beings because they don't see the sun. What isn't really true is drinking ayahuasca and saying it's Santo Daime – that's a big lie, see (laughs)? It's really ayahuasca, that's a great trip! Ice cream turns into beetroot, helicopter turns into an ironing machine, did you live? And give it to the child. That's it, no. It hurts the liver tremendously! The worst thing for the liver is the chacrona, which they call Santo Daime. From Santo, Daime has nothing! It's called ayahuasca, the Indians love it! Take that shit, keep fucking traveling. Then, this has nothing to do with reality, this is already a completely mystical thing – an herb that makes you travel, thinking that here it is here and here it is not, it is there. And there's that damn mess. I say it like this, consciously, little face, without taking anything, without any ritual, without incense – there is no incense either – or rattles. So the thing is totally cosmological, it's true. I was telling the guys yesterday that there are women out there who have had sex with strange beings, there's everything out there.

LLG - I found a simple compact of yours, in English. It was just Tim. No last name. Was that his first album?
TM - 
It was the first, recorded here in São Paulo, by Fermata.

LLG - Was that before you went to the States?
TM - 
No, that's when I came back.

MG - When did you go there anyway?
TM - 
I went three years without speaking a word of Portuguese. I went in 1959 and came back in 1964.

MG - Did it come back or was it “turned back”, Tim?
TM - 
I went back. But I'm fine now, I have four years of visa in my passport, I've been there three times since I was deported. But I was ten years without being able to return. My relationship with the United States is totally emotional, sentimental; It has nothing to do with making money, with a career, none of that. Maybe in the future…

MG - But I think a career there would be great, right?
TM - 
I think it would.

LLG - Have you ever thought about releasing this record in English in the United States?
TM - 
So it is. This one I'm re-recording to release there. I've recorded a lot in English, my songs and others' songs, but I'd like to record even more. In addition to those of bossa nova, because those of bossa nova… They made some very intellectualized lyrics like this "quiet nights of quiet stars“… Gee, nobody speaks that in English. the guy speaks “baby I love you”, “come back to me”, “don't go away”.

LLG - Of the ones you chose for your second bossa nova album, are you going to sing any in English?
TM - 
No, all in Portuguese. Because that doesn't work. It has to be in Portuguese here and in English for them abroad.

LLG - You also said that you wanted to avoid recording songs that João Gilberto had already recorded. That's it?
TM - 
No, that's a joke, it's just a joke. I think João Gilberto is an excellent musician and singer, but with a personality, I think he's like this... four-four-half. Four-four half is a fraction; 4,46 is not even five. It's between four and five – four-four-half.

MG - How did the recording thing with Elis happen?
TM -
 With Elis Regina, I had already recorded two singles. And Erasmo, Rita, Serginho and Arnaldo, from Mutantes, took me to Polygram. When I got there, people already knew me, they already knew the way I sang, I already had the songs ready, the thing with Cassiano had already happened. So much so that I recorded “Primavera” in August 1969 and tried everything to release the record in the spring, but it came out in January 1970. Then, that damn January boiling and me singing “It's spring…” at 40 degrees. But then it broke. When it broke, the record company called me: “Tim Maia, quick, let's record an LP”. That record label thing, huh?

LLG - Then, from that first LP, he played practically everything.
TM - 
In Rio de Janeiro, we stayed 22 weeks in first place. So I think I sold more than 200.

MG - And then you painted the recording with Elis?
TM -
 It was a setup by Nelson Motta, the late Ronaldo Bôscoli, Miele… it came out on her record. But one thing that I didn't think was cool, and that a lot of people still come today to ask me: “Elis Regina threw you?” Wait, I launched Roberto Carlos, how can she launch me? Let's take it easy. But then they came out with this one: “Elis Regina launches Tim Maia”. It was a setup, but she had nothing to do with it. I liked her a lot and I feel like I could have recorded more stuff with her. She was very musical, she was very musical… To this day I say: for me, the best was Elis. Rosana sings well too, but Rosana is very disturbed, very confused, she even put silicone on… she IS the silicone queen. And so beautiful, so hot… Rosana sings well, Jane Duboc sings more or less, but she is very inhibited, that girl, Claudia, sang well, but she excelled. Elis Regina, no; she was on point. And she had a nice, smart head. But people didn't think so. It was that thing: "Oh, she's very temperamental...". All assholes that don't have any feelings, that don't create shit, that can't express themselves with anything, when they see a person who expresses themselves... It's that Van Gogh thing: crazy, crazy, but then his painting is costing 60 million dollars. But at the time, they almost killed the guy.

LLG - And your opinion about Marisa Monte?
TM - 
Funny, Marisa Monte is singing just like Gal Costa, I didn't understand a damn thing.

LLG - But the Gal from the beginning of her career, right?
TM - 
IT'S. Once I heard Marisa Monte and she sounded like Zizi Possi, then I met Marisa, we even made friends. It's not that I'm hurt with her, but look: the "Chocolate", she recorded, sings at shows, but she did something that I didn't like, she sings "I don't want cocaine, I called...", it has nothing to do with it. , music doesn't have that. Lulu Santos also put Porto de Galinhas (in the “Discoverer of the Seven Seas”) where there was no fucking Porto de Galinhas, they totally change it. I think that when you propose to record a song by a person, even when that song has already been recorded, you have to obey that criterion, that way, otherwise there is one thing…

MG - By the way, you changed a word in “Aquarela do Brasil”…
TM -
 Only if I was wrong…, too, it's fucking lyrics. I don't know where this guy was thinking when he wrote those lyrics. “The coconut tree that gives coconut” is too much, right? Will you give what? Orange? Ari Barroso … God bless him.

LLG - Tim, this bossa nova record came out less than a year ago, now you're releasing another one and do you have two more in the pipeline for this year?
TM -
 Look, I'm the CEO of Vitória Régia Discos, the only one that pays on Sundays after 21 pm. I'm the only artist in the house, so there's no way... I'd like to have Stevie Wonder with us too, but...

LLG - Ah, Ray Charles is coming over now. Invite him...
TM - 
But he's selling little record. I prefer Leandro and Leonardo, who are selling much more (laughs).

MG - Tim, you were in a group, a long time ago, with Roberto, Erasmo, Jorge Ben and then another group – Cassiano, Hyldon…
TM -
 Yeah, this is the second team.

MG - That previous team did well; the second does not. Why?
TM -
 Well, there's that thing: “Why does Tostine sell more? Because it's fresh. And why is it fresh? Because he sells more.” Do you want to see something? I did the Jô Soares show the other day and played with the kids' age. Later, she said that there was a time when Roberto Carlos was smoking a pipe and wearing a strange cape, while Erasmo wanted to enter the Academia de Letras. I said: “Calm down, nobody here studied shit, stop with this business because here, nobody is intellectual”. I said this at Jô Soares and added: “We don't have any course, the only one we have, and even so incomplete, is the typing course at Colégio Ultra”. Then, the other day, I called Jorge Ben and he was pissed, all angry. I asked: “What happened, Jorge?”. And he: “Do you know what Tim is? My aunt watched Jô Soares and told me that you spoke ill of me”. I said: "But what's this boy, I never spoke ill of you, what an asshole". So, I called his wife on the phone, Domingas, and she told me: “No Tim, don't care, that's Jorge's aunt, who is very gossipy…”. Then, I found out that he was pissed off about the age thing I said. Because he says he's 46… if he's 46, I'm 38. What I wanted to explain is that Jorge Ben wasn't part of our first class. I met him a little later. But I think he got angry because I said that we had no culture. And he doesn't have it either, he didn't study shit...

LLG - You and Jorge Ben kind of resurfaced together, about three years ago…
TM - 
No, that's also another thing I want to rectify. We didn't resurrect, he resurrected. I just wasn't in the media, I wasn't in Globo. I give this example: I did five years of Chic Show here in São Paulo, two shows a year. There was a time when we put 23 people there in Palmeiras, there was another one that broke I don't know what there and the guy didn't even want to rent it to Tião do Chic Show anymore. Afterwards, I recorded with Sandra de Sá and was going to do a show with her. But she was half a star, she didn't show up, and I took the biggest loss because of Marcos Lázaro. Now there's such a (Manoel) Poladian. Every hour there's one, and everything with those weird names, there's no Pereira or Silva. Lázaro, Poladian… I heard one from Poladian that is awesome: he takes a bus full of money changers. He arrives at the venue, buys the tickets himself and then sells them for triple the price.

LLG - I related you to Jorge because he has an album of his that is being re-released now that has several disco-style songs. Now, Jorge is re-recording his old hits with dance music style. Did you ever hear this?
TM -
 I think what they're doing is utter bullshit. This is nothing. Popcorn is in hand, everyone wants popcorn… Lee pants are in fashion, everyone wants Lee pants… And then, in one of these, the guy can get burned, Jorge Ben can get burned. Because his music has nothing to do with house, his music is already a normal house and everyone dances normally, you don't need to put a bass drum there, a pile driver to do something. A guy proposed this to me, but I said, “Drop the 'new ice age' then full steam ahead and we'll see if everyone doesn't go to the track”. You don't need tum-tum-tum to imitate American even more and with something that takes away the musicality of the thing. I could have already done that, I was already invited to do that. In an article I read in the newspaper yesterday, Lulu Santos was praising me: “Tim Maia is the greatest”. Thank you thank you very much. Then the guy says, the DJ Memê. Oh the guy's name: Meme. And he sends the following: “Oh, I like Tim Maia, I've always been a fan of his, but now he's given up singing these tacky songs…”. And I thought xiii… look at the guy, look at Memê… what does he play? Does he play the oboe, play the timpani, play the violin?

MG - He plays turntables.
TM -
 Yeah, he plays turntables. He plays records in reverse. He studied like hell, concentrated to do that nhé-nhé-nhé… How can a Memê like that talk about us? I launched Roberto Carlos, I did a lot of things, a lot of stops there, high plays. This is the guy who is with Lulu Santos. I mean, I'm also thinking that Lulu Santos is heading down the same path… You have to be careful. He's already old, his hair is white… This funk, house thing, leave it to others. And another thing: this Brazilian funk thing… Brazilian rap is a disgrace. Mainly rap from Rio, but also from São Paulo. Imitates the American, stays that nigga doing those things (hums a typical carioca “spoken funk”). Is this funky? Is this rap? Rap is full of aga, rap is actually Jamaican and it's way beyond what's done here. That's why I think Brazil is in urgent need of music courses, music schools. Another thing I would like to say is that Brazil is in urgent need of a university for blacks, for blacks, an Afro-Brazilian university. Because we have a university of all kinds there, a university for priests, a university for Bishop Macedo, we need a university for blacks. White and Japanese can also enter, without discrimination, but giving priority to black people. Because black people can't, they don't have anywhere to study, they don't go beyond elementary school. So, I think that in Brazil, in different places, there must be an Afro-Brazilian university. That's a damn cricket, you have to put the black to study; otherwise, we will always be on the bottom. Globo, now, puts the (Antônio) Pitanga in the soap opera, that black family, but it has nothing to do with it, continues indirect discrimination.

MG - You mentioned Roberto Carlos… Don't you think it was time for him to touch himself and record a new album, instead of repeating the same thing ten years ago?
TM -
 But I think Roberto Carlos is right. He's been there for thirty years and has been successful. And my mother liked him a lot. Until my mother died, he called her every Christmas, did that average, he knows all my brothers, my sisters, just like I know his. We were raised together. So I found it very strange when I came back from the States, he gave me the biggest pruning. Because when I came back, I needed support. It even had a step (prison) that I pulled there in the United States, eight months old, because of some chairs I stole for a recording. We were going to make a recording and then I went to steal the chairs to buy an incentive for the guys. But I didn't even buy the incentive; I already danced on the chairs (laughs). I asked for help, but for what? Wow, I thought that was so weird. I don't know Roberto Carlos' children, I only know the oldest, Ana Paula, Nice's daughter. He doesn't know my children either. I already have a granddaughter, so does he.

MG - How many children do you have?
TM - 
I have three children and now a granddaughter.

MG - Do any of them live with you?
TM -
 They already lived. One lived. And the middle one is always in my house. But the youngest, no; the youngest lives with my sister. She took my son from a young age. In fact, I didn't raise any of my three children. Only stab wounds – from 10 thousand, from 100 thousand -, I only finance. My granddaughter is the daughter of Zé Carlos, the oldest. She's cute, very nice. I preserve this family business. Just yesterday, I was talking to Erasmo's son on the phone… and I remembered once that Erasmo gave me five Saint-Tropez pants, the kind that your butt shows when you get in a taxi, you know. Imagine, I have a hundred and I don't know how many kilos and with those pants… I always tell that to Erasmo's son, Gugu. So, I feel this family business and I'm sorry that people who were raised together like me, Roberto, Erasmo, don't know each other's children personally. My sisters love them, Ed Motta's mother is very fond of Roberto.

MG - And Ed Motta, do you get along with him?
TM - 
No, I don't.

MG - Do you think he is your successor?
TM - 
I think this successor thing is so horrible… This is a dictator thing.

LLG - And heir, maybe?
TM - 
This heir thing is also bad. It's even bad for him, because he got into it and got sick of it.

LLG - And he's been talking really bad about you...
TM - 
Well, such a strange thing… my nephew, hey.

MG - And he has talent, right?
TM - 
Yes, he sings well. It's musical, but very convoluted, weird as hell. Ed stopped talking to me and I don't really like to talk about it because I'm very good friends with his mother, she's my sister who I consider very much.

MG - Tim, Fernando Gabeira has a project to release marijuana. Are you for or against it?
TM - 
Honestly, man, Fernando Gabeira was once one thing, he became another and now he's a totally different thing. When he kidnapped that ambassador, damn… I was very supportive, you know? Then, it came with this Green Party thing, it was already half four-four-half and now it's diluted too much. Marijuana is already legal, cocaine and the death penalty too. This has been released in Brazil for a long time. Want more weed than in Brazil? Brazil is the largest producer of marijuana in the world! Nobody grows more marijuana than Brazil. And Pernambuco is the state where most marijuana is planted in the world. And the Brazilian is the biggest pothead in the world! An alcoholic too, par excellence, but he burns a violent smoke! Every Brazilian burns tobacco: go to the North, damn it, everyone likes it… In the South, they love it too. Everyone, everyone! So I think it's a fucking demagoguery. You could plant it there and reap good fruits, good marijuana, very strong THC…

MG - Yeah, but there are still the poor people who go to cane just because of a joint…
TM -
 It's stupid. But it seems to me that the business will release more now, at least at home. There's that girl who's being judged right now in Turkey. She said she didn't know that what they gave her was marijuana... how naive (laughs). All she knows is that the guy's name was Pedro, that's all. Who gave you the weed? Peter. Who gave you the brizola? Jorge… but I don't know. And the guys who came to receive the brizola? Hmm, I don't know, I don't know (laughs). Poor thing, you're in bad shape. But in that movie, Midnight Express, the guy is carrying five kilos of hashish, and I thought he was heroin… Hashish is the best thing there is to calm the mood, it doesn't hurt anyone, it's good for glaucoma. I think it's stupid, a fucking demagoguery, to ban smoking, you know? Tobacco is a plant, a natural thing… I was summoned twice this week, to go to the police. I'm not going anywhere. There's a guy there who was arrested, they beat him up so he could say he was bringing me hashish. Then, in court, the guy said it was nothing like that, that he was beaten up at the police station, on the 27th, there in Brás de Pina, in Rio de Janeiro. So, I was subpoenaed and sent my lawyers there…

MG - The three, right?
TM - 
This time there were two (laughs). But they went there to explain… Every now and then they try to get me involved in this shit, man, and because of hash. Even if it was cocaine, heroin… but hash? It's stupid. THC… cannabis… Forbidding cannabis and releasing alcohol is the biggest madness, a dirty, dirty, filthy, lying thing! Because alcohol destroys a human being in a few years, in months. If you really drink, your figueiredo can't take it. I myself can't drink anymore. And look, I didn't drink much, huh? I only drank when I performed and when I was on a plane.

MG - But since you did a lot of shows and traveled by plane a lot… (laughs).
TM -
 Yeah, I played shows all year, I flew all year round, I drank all year (laughs). But he made a deal with the figueiredo here… I can't drink at all. Roberto drinks a lot more than I do, Erasmo is drinking three of those tiny little bottles a day… Jair Rodrigues drinks a lot more than I do and then says he's a straight face. But I mean, due to drinking excessive amounts, I almost danced. So hey… I have a friend who has been smoking tobacco for thirty years and is not addicted yet (laughs).

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